Comments on Mind the Gap!: Not a Feminist

Thanks Cristy!

2005-10-25T10:57:00.000+01:00

Thanks Cristy!

You post made me think, and then post. So, in lieu...

2005-10-24T09:34:00.000+01:00

You post made me think, and then post. So, in lieu of trackback: http://nopod.blogspot.com/2005/10/im-not-feminist-but.html

The first time that I came across young women who ...

2005-10-24T06:11:00.000+01:00

The first time that I came across young women who recoiled at the idea of being called a 'feminist' was when I moved to the States for High School. I was also shocked that they used the term 'socialist' as a bad word.

To me, this really showed the incredible success of backlash campaigns over both issues and also a strange belief that women in America were already equal and, therefore, to be a feminist simply meant that you were a man-hating (hairy, butch) lesbian [and that this was somehow a very bad thing to be].

I was shocked, because to me not being a feminist (be you male or female) means that you are a misogynist. It is like being against any kind of equality campaign.

I totally disagree that we should just let the term go and let the conservative backlash control its definition. However, it may be worth allowing for some nuances in the definitions of feminism.

There is a substantial difference between liberal feminists, cultural feminists, and postmodern feminists. Many young women may strongly reject some (hopefully not all) of the underlying assumptions behind liberal feminism, but still agree with the ideology of postmodern or cultural feminism. Some (like me) think that the basic premise of equality is the most important thing, but believe that exactly what "equality" means is a very complicated and nuanced thing that is very difficult to summarise into a theory... (ie more postmodern).

Anonymous,Feminist means man-hating, femininity ha...

2005-10-21T11:52:00.000+01:00

Anonymous,

Feminist means man-hating, femininity hating, ugly and unsuccessful whiny victim.

Well, it might mean that to some people, but that's not my definition and, personally, I don't think we should surrender to the backlash and let it start re-defining us. I get yout point and I've heard this view expressed by feminists, but don't you think the media would soon catch us at it, figure out that we'd started using a different term, and get to work on making it a perjorative too? I'm not sure you could dodge anti-feminist rhetoric in this way.

Tikistitch,

I really like the term Feministas too and I like to reclaim perjoratives. I think it would be great if we could do for feminism what we've managed to do for "queer."

Right Haplo first, The statement above seems to wa...

2005-10-21T11:46:00.000+01:00

Right Haplo first,

The statement above seems to want to assign all blame for failure on "the man" perhaps literally, perhaps figuratively.

No I didn't want to imply that anybody's personal failure is due to "the man." It's not "the man" it's the entire system into which certain inequalities are written. Nor did I want to suggest that we don't have personal responsibility for our lives.

I was trying to explain, perhaps not very well, why the phrase "the personal is political" is important. Take me, for instance, I am very proud of my achievements, and I'm not going to let anything take that away from me. However, as a white, middle-class woman, I think it would be pretty criminal of me not to acknowledge that I've had huge advantages in my life over many other people in all sorts of areas. I was talking to a primary school teacher who worked in a very under privileged area once. She told me that when the children started at her school, many of them had never even seen a pencil, whereas many of the children of middle-class parents arrive at school already able to read. While some of the kids from the poor area will achieve, there is no point in pretending that everyone started off fair and equal. So, I don't think it's about devaluing anyone's individual achievement or alleviating all responsibility for failures, it's about accepting some social and economic realities, protesting and trying to rectify them.

I think the word feminist is like the word "libera...

2005-10-21T03:27:00.000+01:00

I think the word feminist is like the word "liberal"--we've lost the battle over what it means. Feminist means man-hating, femininity hating, ugly and unsuccessful whiny victim.

That's an awesome point, and I wish there were a bit of discussion about what we call ourselves.

My personal view, I'd like us to take a page from the splendiferous Queer Pride movement, and embrace every single pejorative that's ever been slammed against us. Las Feministas? Damn right. We're here, get used to it.

One clear advantage of this strategy: feminists have often been tarred as humorless (which is absolutely insane--can't exist as a smart woman without a sense of humor).

I think the word feminist is like the word "libera...

2005-10-20T16:26:00.000+01:00

I think the word feminist is like the word "liberal"--we've lost the battle over what it means. Feminist means man-hating, femininity hating, ugly and unsuccessful whiny victim.

So, let the term go. Invent another one. Say things like, "feminism, like the abolition movement, was really progressive for its time and made real changes we all benefit from today, but it's not 1970 anymore, and Harvard doesn't have one school for men and another one for women. Nowadays we need another movement to address the unfair burdens, stereotypes and double standards we see today..."

Part of it is a result of the active campaign of demonization by conservatives. But another part of it is that progressive people don't want to exist in the past--by definition, they want a world that's new and improved. We're falling into a trap if we attempt to get women to put a label on themselves that's so old and so stigmatized.

We're in good shape here--it's not our ideas that are odious, it's our label. So, change the brand name and talk about the ideas of this new "21st century movement."

>Patriarchal, capitalist, racist and homophobic so...

2005-10-19T23:04:00.000+01:00

>Patriarchal, capitalist, racist and homophobic society wants us to believe that if we are unhappy, it is because we have failed on a personal level, rather than because we live in a society that depends upon many institutionalized inequalities and oppressions.

Are you looking for any sort of middle ground here? I don't see much. The statement above seems to want to assign all blame for failure on "the man" perhaps literally, perhaps figuratively. But failure on a personal level is indeed the correct explanation for why some things don't go as planned. If I wanted to consider myself independent and strong, that kind of rhetoric is not very inspiring. Its even a little condescending because it implies that if your failures are not your own, then neither are your successes.

Well I think you've hit the nail on the head reall...

2005-10-17T21:58:00.000+01:00

Well I think you've hit the nail on the head really because dragging our consciousness raising again may be the way forward. One of the problems with these young women is precisely the fact that they haven't done any consciousness raising work.

As to the 'V' word, they often like to think of themselves as "independent." I hear phrases such as "I'm not a feminist, but I can look after myself." They don't realise that it was feminism that made female independence more acceptable and even desirable in the first place. Generally speaking, they strongly resist seeing themselves as powerless victims of patriarchy (who would!) and perhaps that's what we now need to work with.

The thing is, they are victims. The fact that they...

2005-10-16T03:45:00.000+01:00

The thing is, they are victims. The fact that they don't know it tells me that something went very wrong. How many times do we have to drag out consciousness-raising, for god's sake?

Absolutely. The whole "feminism is so over" positi...

2005-10-15T22:51:00.000+01:00

Absolutely.

The whole "feminism is so over" position necessitates a refusal to acknowledge or identify with the struggles of women around the world. I'm generalising here, but these anti-feminist young women seem to be saying that, since women in the west have relatively good rights and freedoms, everything's fine now. They couldn't give a shit about anyone else. But, as they reject the notion of sisterhood, I guess it's not surprising that they're not interested in global sisterhood. It is a vile attitude when you think about it: "I'm alright, feminists won me my place in university, my right to a career, my contraception etc etc, so now women around the world can burn for all I care." Horrible.

They are also ignoring geography, are women who ar...

2005-10-15T22:26:00.000+01:00

They are also ignoring geography, are women who are set alight in India or girl children put out to die in China also failing to take responsebility for thier own lives its, a bit hard if your only two. Everyones a victim of something sometime in thier lives shall we give up fighting crime because people who have been burgled ,hit by a drunk driver,encountered fraud, are victims.We need to debunk the idea of the victim mentality along with the cancer personality and the karmically indebted ect, they are false constructs put about by the powers that be,( in these cases patriarchy and pharmaseutical companies) to stop us asking questions about the things they are doing.